Change is all around! A key skill for business (and life) is knowing when it’s time to make a change, how to do so gracefully, and how to get support for whatever God is calling you to do next.
In this episode, Julie and Jory reveal changes in their businesses. Julie describes the path that’s prompted her to change her business name and to approach business development using a fresh model. Jory shares the news that this is the final month of Heart and Soul for Women of Faith, plus her next steps.
As an extrovert and daughter of a Naval officer, Jory welcomes change as an opportunity for growth. Listen as Jory describes how change can keep up humble and leaning on God rather than our own resources. Julie, an introvert who doesn’t necessarily seek out change, analogizes making changes to climbing a mountain by reaching for the next handhold or foothold, relying on God to find the right steps, rather than charging straight up. Through our conversation, you’ll explore two ways of looking at change, both grounded in faith, and you’ll get ideas on how to recognize and execute the changes that you’re being called to make.
About Julie Fleming
Julie A. Fleming, principal of Lex Innova Consulting, helps lawyers and other service professionals to create and implement innovative business development plans. She is the author of three books as well as numerous articles on topics such as business development, practice management, work/life balance, and leadership development. You can find out more about Julie at Lex Innova Consulting.
Julie’s Success Tips
- Watch for the hints that you’re being called to change.
- Lean on God and wise counsel from friends, family, and colleagues to navigate change.
- Remember that change leads to growth and keeps us fresh.
Julie’s Quote of the Day
“It may be hard for an egg to turn into a bird: it would be a jolly sight harder for it to learn to fly while remaining an egg. We are like eggs at present. And you cannot go on indefinitely being just an ordinary, decent egg. We must be hatched or go bad.” ~C.S. Lewis
Jory’s Success Tips
1. Pray and seek wise counsel before making significant changes in your life, career, or business.
2. Try to keep everything else in your life as normal as possible.
3. Remember to take care of yourself:
- Get plenty of rest
- Exercise several times a week
- Eat small, healthy meals throughout the day
Jory’s Quote of the Day
“Accept the challenges, so that you may feel the exhilaration of victory.” ~General George S. Patton
Listen to Jory and Julie by clicking the audio player below.
Piano music by David Nevue.
Change Is All Around! How to Know When to Change
and How to Thrive Through Change
Heart & Soul for Women of Faith
Year 6, Episode 205
Jory H. Fisher, JD, PCC – www.JoryFisher.com
Julie Fleming, JD – www.LexInnovaConsulting.com
Jory Fisher: Hello and welcome to Heart & Soul for Women of Faith, a radio show designed specifically for Christian women leaders and entrepreneurs. My co-hosts and I focus our discussions on how to live a joyful and purposeful life by developing healthy bodies and souls, healthy minds and finances, and healthy relationships. Our goal is to help you nourish your physical, mental, and spiritual well-being so you can make the difference you’re called to make and glorify God through success. I’m Jory Fisher, a featured host on BlogTalkRadio with my
co-host: author, speaker, consultant, and my dear friend for decades, Julie Fleming. Good evening, Julie, and thank you for joining me for Year Six, Episode 205 of Heart & Soul for Women of Faith. How are you this evening?
Julie Fleming: I am doing well, Jory. Always pleased to be with you.
Jory Fisher: Yay! And there you are in Atlanta and here I am in Bel Air, Maryland, and summer is upon us, hallelujah, right?
Julie Fleming: Exactly and by the miracle of technology, we could be sipping iced tea together.
Jory Fisher: Ahh, very good. Very good. I can’t drink iced tea at night or I’ll stay up all night, but it’s a nice idea.
Julie Fleming: Then decaf.
Jory Fisher: Decaf iced tea.
Julie Fleming: That works.
Jory Fisher: Before we start our conversation, we’d like to tell you a little bit about who we are and how we each fulfill our calling. As a Professional Certified Coach and Top Six Expert, I specialize in helping Christian leaders and entrepreneurs get crystal clear on their calling and create healthy lives and businesses so they can make a bigger, more meaningful contribution to the world. Please visit JoryFisher.com to sign up for free e-books and to enjoy hundreds of blog posts and radio show podcasts. Also as an Ambassador for the EMsquared Project, also known as the Hope Bar Project, I’m helping eliminate childhood malnutrition through the sustainable model of social entrepreneurship. Please visit JoryFisher.com/ShareHope to learn about this quickly growing global movement and how you too can get involved. Julie, your turn, please introduce yourself to our listeners.
Julie Fleming: With pleasure. My name is Julie Fleming and I am principal of Lex Innova Consulting, which is a company based in Atlanta. I work primarily with lawyers but occasionally also with other professionals, and I help them find ways to bring in new business, develop new clients and feel really good about the process. I have written three books thus far. I actually have a fourth in the works, Jory.
Jory Fisher: Ohh!
Julie Fleming: I know. You can find out more about the work that I do as well as about those books at LexInnovaConsulting.com. That’s L-E-X-I-N-N-O-V-AConsulting.com.
Jory Fisher: You know I’m going to ask you about that, so if you’re going to let the cat out of the bag anywhere, I hope that’s on this show today.
Julie Fleming: Of course. Where else would I want to announce it?
Jory Fisher: Ah, very good.
Julie Fleming: Right?
Jory Fisher: I love it. Okay, All right so just a few words about how to listen to and participate in Heart & Soul for Women of Faith, which has been airing on Wednesday evenings at 8:30 PM Eastern on BlogTalkRadio. You can listen to any of our archived on-demand episodes, follow this show, and add Heart & Soul to your iTunes library by going to BlogTalkRadio.com/JoryFisher. We encourage you to share Heart & Soul with your friends and family using the social media icons on BlogTalkRadio and on JoryFisher.com, and to post your comments and questions for us on my Facebook page, Jory Hingson Fisher.
All right, Julie, well, I will just briefly say what we’re going to talk about and then I am going to interview you or should I say interrogate you.
Julie Fleming: Uh-oh, that sounds scary. Let’s stick to interview or just talk with.
Jory Fisher: I know. Okay, talk with, we’ll go with that. It’s the whole “lawyer asking questions of another lawyer” thing that probably comes up but anyway… Julie and I are talking about change today and the importance of change and the role of change. Gosh, you know, does change have a purpose anyway? So that’s what we’re going to be talking about and, Julie, can we start with your book?
Julie Fleming: Sure. That is a change and the reason for it is also a change. The book is going to be all about a new approach that I call becoming a “RainMaster” as opposed to a “rainmaker.” It comes out of the thought that, at least in law, being a rainmaker is this huge thing that everybody aspires, at least everybody in private practice, because it’s seen as the key to a successful practice. If you go into anything thinking, “I have to do this. I want to do this. I want to be this. I want to be that.” It’s so “I” focused. I want to get clients so that I can make more money and I can be more influential in my firm and so that I can do all of these things. My first book, Jory, you know is titled The Reluctant Rainmaker so it’s something that certainly is baked into everything that I have done thus far.
Jory Fisher: Right.
Julie Fleming: But I sat back and I started thinking about it and realized two things: 1) I believe in the generative power of language and that what we say and how we say it has effects far beyond our speech, and I believe 2) that when you go into any sort of business-getting opportunity or if you’re just trying to talk with someone and thinking, “Hmm, maybe this will lead t0 business,” there’s nothing wrong with that all. That’s a great thing. But when the process is couched in terms of, “What can I get? I’m going to land you as a client so that I can…” not “So that I can help the client do this, that, and the other…”
Jory Fisher: Yes.
Julie Fleming: To my mind that’s just wrong. That’s putting the emphasis in the wrong place. It undermines the integrity of the process and for people who are not excited about the prospect of sales, which is pretty much my entire clientele, it makes the process something that is kind of icky and gross, and something we don’t really want to do. So thinking about all of that, I came up with this term “the RainMaster” to talk about someone who approaches getting business in a different way. Someone who approaches it from the perspective of asking, what does this person need? How can I help this person get his or her needs met? Whether that’s through working with me, whether it’s through my referring this person to someone else, whatever it takes to help this person in front of me. That is a much more comfortable approach for many people.
I would suggest that it’s an approach with more integrity to it, and it’s also an approach that when you do it in the proper way, you follow up in the proper way, and you put some of the how-to’s around it can lead to a terrific practice. I know, just thinking back, when I’ve spoken with a potential client and I finished up the conversation—I had a conversation like this just earlier this week—I said, “Really at this point, I am not the best person to help you. What you need is this and that. I can do that but it’s not my area of specialty and I would rather send you to the person who is top in the field in that. So please call So-and-So.” Every time I’ve said something like that, the response I’ve received is “Thank you so much. I will call them. I really appreciate you telling me that there is somebody who would be better about that and when I need what it is that you do, I am going to call you back,” and I’ve seen it happen.
Jory Fisher: Mm-hmm, cool.
Julie Fleming: In a really short version, that is what the book is about and that’s what this, for me at least, revolutionary chain of thought is all about.
Jory Fisher: Wow! Wow, okay, and so that’s what your book is going to be about, how to become a RainMaster.
Julie Fleming: Yes, exactly.
Jory Fisher: I love it. Okay, so because I love words, I do have to ask you what we mean by “rain” because whenever I’ve thought about rainmaking, you know, just that term—and of course I know that’s not one you coined, it’s something that has been around for a long time, at least lawyers have talked about it in law firms: “Ooh, who’s the rainmaker in this firm?” You know, I kind of think of the old tradition. I mean, we think of, or I think of anyway, maybe it’s wrong, but Native American Indians with the rainmaking. You know, really trying to create rain to come down and nourish the land. So when I thought about rainmaking in a lawyer sense, in a law firm sense, in a corporate setting for example, I thought, okay, you know, it’s raining clients! It’s raining business! So what do we mean? (Do you remember that song, “It’s Raining Men”? That cracked me up.)
Julie Fleming: Oh yes.
Jory Fisher: So what do we mean by “RainMaster”? Explain that one.
Julie Fleming: It means someone who is adept at the process of generating business but who has mastered the ability to do it from a client-centric perspective.
Jory Fisher: Yes, yes.
Julie Fleming: Again, it’s a very similar kind of thing in terms of the bottom line. You want to get more business and of course you’d like to do that for personal reasons – to advance your career, to have more money so you can send your child to college or whatever it is that you like.
Jory Fisher: Sure.
Julie Fleming: But it’s coming at it from a different perspective than the traditional.
Jory Fisher: Yes, a place of genuine service.
Julie Fleming: Exactly.
Jory Fisher: Yes, as you say, what you talk about, what you think about, your attitude, all of that can bring about results that are, or could be, totally different. I mean, someone can approach a situation using one set of words or one attitude and get that, and approach the same situation with another set of words, another attitude and get that instead and be completely different – whether it’s positive or negative. Is it self-centered or other-centered? What kind of leadership is it? Is it servant leadership? So yes, language and attitude are incredibly, incredibly important.
Well, I know you have some other things going on because you probably have been thinking, not so much about an attitude change but a language change. So what’s going on in your life where you might be changing some languaging?
Julie Fleming: Oh, change is in the air. It’s such an exciting time. A few months ago, I decided to hire a company to help me do some brand reshaping. I was actually thinking that it was going to be purely to help me tighten up some visual imagery around my business, to come up with some better colors to represent what I’m doing, to come up with some better marketing materials, things like that.
Jory Fisher: Right.
Julie Fleming: And when I talked with these people who are so incredibly sharp, their first question was, “So what does Lex Innova mean to your clients?” I said, “Well, to somebody who is not a lawyer, it means absolutely nothing but to somebody who is a lawyer, “Lex” of course is Latin for “law” and “Innova” is suggestive of innovation. So it’s a fresh look at ways to practice law.” They said, “Oh, well that’s great. Okay.” We went on and they wanted to interview a few of my clients. So they came back. They talked with I think maybe four, five of my clients and they also interviewed some other lawyers who had never heard of me, came back with some fantastic information. And for anybody who is listening who serves clients, I cannot recommend strongly enough, just the process of having somebody talk with your clients to find out what’s important to them, what they get from working with you, what they’d like to see from working with you, it’s invaluable. Have you ever done that, Jory? I’m just curious.
Jory Fisher: I’ve interviewed my own clients and prospective clients. I’ve surveyed my clients, you know, like midpoint evaluation then “after coaching” evaluations, and I’ve certainly done the survey of people who represent my target market so I could understand what their needs were, etc., when I was first setting up my target market, establishing it, but I’ve never had a consultant come in whom I’ve hired and I’ve given authorization and my clients have accepted because I’m sure there are confidentiality issues that you have to deal with. So no, I’ve never had a third party disinterested, totally objective consultant go in and talk to my clients.
Julie Fleming: Yes, this was my first time too and it was really fascinating.
Jory Fisher: Wow.
Julie Fleming: Yes and the biggest thing that came back—there were so much useful information that I’m going to take into account as I go forward, but the thing that stunned me is they started off by saying, “Yes, so we asked your clients what Lex Innova means to them and their response was Hmmm, nothing. We don’t really understand it. It’s kind of confusing and we are not used to being confused. So we really don’t like it.” You could have knocked me over with a feather. I had no idea. I had no idea. So many people had told me what a great name it is, and I had no idea at all. But of course getting feedback like that it made me sit back and say, “Well, maybe it’s time for me to change the name to something people do understand.”
Jory Fisher: Okay. You were probably also thinking about money.
Julie Fleming: Oh, yes, absolutely. Absolutely I was. I so appreciate my clients being willing to stand up and say, “Yes, I have no clue what she’s talking about.” That’s not easy, especially for lawyers, I think but really for anybody. It’s not easy to say, “I have no idea what this is all about.”
Jory Fisher: Right.
Julie Fleming: But having had that feedback, the big change coming up is the change in business name and that, of course, has been influenced tremendously by these client interviews. So should I share the new business name?
Jory Fisher: I’m ready.
Julie Fleming: All right. It’s Fleming Strategic.
Jory Fisher: Yay! Of course we know where “Fleming” comes from.
Julie Fleming: We do, we do. The way that it came about is that the two things that came out from the client interviews is that they really valued the work with me personally. I’m delighted to say that.
Jory Fisher: Yes.
Julie Fleming: One of my rules is that I only work with people I really like and so it was nice to hear that they really like me too. That’s Sally Field – “They like me. They really like me!”
Jory Fisher: Exactly. I think of her often.
Julie Fleming: Exactly. But the word came back that I, personally me, I’m central to my business. That should be reflected in the name, which was a huge epiphany to me. Then the second thing is that the strategic input, the work that we’ve put together on the strategy and then working out how to implement the strategy is huge for my client. They are strategic. So it’s such a simple name but it encompasses so much. And I have a great new tag-line that just changes the focus a little more.
Jory Fisher: Wow. All right, what have you learned from all of these, besides the fact that it’s good and it is humbling to hire somebody to come in and interview your clients? What other lessons have you learned?
Julie Fleming: The biggest one I think it is to be open, to keep asking questions. To keep listening and to be open to the thing that you do not think is possible. When I spoke with these consultants initially, they said, “Had you thought about changing your name?” I said, “Well, I want to have the right business name but no. You can ask the question, but I would virtually guarantee you that we are going to come out and stay with Lex Innova.”
Jory Fisher: Oops. Wow-.
Julie Fleming: Yes, but also to listen to the little hints because if I had been listening more closely, I was laughing about this as I was introducing myself a few minutes ago. Probably if you have to spell your business name every time you introduce yourself, that’s an issue. It never occurred to me, never occurred to me.
Jory Fisher: I am delighted for the change. I like Lex Innova in the sense that, thankfully I did know what it meant being a lawyer and all.
Julie Fleming: Yes.
Jory Fisher: I just thought it sounded cool but even knowing what it means, you still have to stop and think about it a little bit more or a whole lot more than Fleming Strategic.
Julie Fleming: Right.
Jory Fisher: It kind of brings you down to the people too, Julie. Instead of a Latin word which, you know, whenever you use a foreign language that it’s just a little bit, I don’t know, a little bit “high brow,” so to speak, and Fleming Strategic is still very, very classy and a person doesn’t have to run to the dictionary or Google it.
Julie Fleming: Right, that’s absolutely true.
Jory Fisher: Wow, that’s exciting.
Julie Fleming: Well, I want to make one more point about it that hit me…
Jory Fisher: Okay.
Julie Fleming: …which is that using my name in my business name lines up perfectly because of course most law firm names are Flintstones and Brown.
Jory Fisher: Right.
Julie Fleming: So it makes me also fit in better with my clientele and that’s a good thing.
Jory Fisher: Good point.
Julie Fleming: Yes. We could talk about the things that I have learned here for hours.
Jory Fisher: Mm-hmm, wow cool. So at some point, even though you don’t have uncles and nieces and nephews, and brothers and sisters and mothers and fathers, just for fun, you could be “Fleming, Fleming and Fleming” and then you’d really sound like a law firm, right?
Julie Fleming: I would sound like the joke where the person calls up and says, “Could I speak to Fleming?” “I’m sorry, she’s out.” “May I speak to Fleming?” “Oh, I’m sorry she’s out too,” and so on.
Jory Fisher: But just one Fleming — Fleming Strategic.
Julie Fleming: I think we’ll stick with that, yes. I think one Fleming is sufficient.
Jory Fisher: All right. Talking about change, we believe change is important. How does a person know when it’s time for a change? What are some signals that we can look for?
Julie Fleming: I think it’s the little things. Again, just like I was saying with having to spell my business name. Are there signals? Are you getting that feeling that something is off? I know we are going to talk about some change in the air for you soon, Jory, and my hunch is that you have had some inklings leading up to making some decisions. It’s listening to that voice, the voice of God, the intuitive voice, the hints that something is not the way it should be. I think it takes some detective work sometimes and if you get to the point, at least in my life, when I get to the point where I have been resisting change for too long, it no longer requires detective work. It’s more like—can I survive the current situation because I am being so thoroughly led to make a change that I’m resisting. That’s true in business. It certainly is true in personal life.
Jory Fisher: Sure is, okay. So listen for the signals. What about consulting other people? I don’t mean a formal consultation necessarily like you did. Do we seek wise counsel? What do we do?
Julie Fleming: That’s never a mistake in my book. I think that we need to be careful with it because people want to be helpful and they want to be kind. So we have to come from a place of pure humility, as pure as we can anyway, and say, “Look, please don’t try to preserve my feelings. I really want to know what you see here even if it’s tough for me to swallow,” and giving permission to get the hard feedback. Maybe it will be hard, maybe it won’t, who knows? But in my experience, giving that permission makes a difference in the information that you get back.
Jory Fisher: Wow.
Julie Fleming: But I think wise counsel is always a benefit regardless of the situation.
Jory Fisher: Sure. Okay, so you and I have both been through significant changes in our lives, both personally and professionally. What tips and suggestions do you have for helping a person navigate a significant change?
Julie Fleming: For me I think it comes down to, again, being very present to what’s going on, and acknowledging the discomfort that probably exists, and being open to again the hints of the pathway, looking for the coincidences. Just looking for the things that you can hold on to. I think about mountain climbing. You don’t just suddenly run up this mountain as I understand it—and I suppose I should say out loud that I am not a mountain climber nor do I pretend to be on TV. But my understanding is that you look at the mountain and you look for the rocks. You look for the ones close to you that you can get a hand hold on, that you can get a foot hold on, and you climb that mountain by grasping the rocks that are close to you. I think there is an analogy there, don’t take on the whole change all at once. Just move into it.
Jory Fisher: Okay.
Julie Fleming: That’s my view. What have you found successful?
Jory Fisher: Well, definitely prayer, definitely wise counsel. Definitely self-care, getting rest, not freaking out, eating healthy. Don’t go on a big eating or drinking binge. Just try to keep as many things normal in your life as possible. There have been times in my life and changes. Have you ever seen those scorecards, if you will, where certain life changes are actually assigned points like divorce, death, and moving?
Julie Fleming: Oh yes.
Jory Fisher: Yes. Oh my goodness. I remember when, within two weeks time I got married to my wonderful husband and “acquired” four more children, and my father died and then nine months later my mother died. Wow! And I got a new job. It was like, “Hello. Can we do anything else here?” But as much as possible to try not to have any more than one big thing, one big significant change at a time…
Julie Fleming: Yes.
Jory Fisher: …that’s within your control.
Julie Fleming: Right. I totally agree with that. Sometimes you can pull that off and then in your example, of course, there really is not a lot you could have done to only have one of those.
Jory Fisher: Yes. It can be good; it can be good.
Julie Fleming: It can be good. It can be scary. It can be very exciting. And I know change is in the air for you!
Jory Fisher: Well, yes. It’s not a huge change. It’s not a huge change. What Julie is referring to is I’m actually bringing Heart & Soul for Women of Faith to a close after six and a half years, almost seven years if we count my time over in VoiceAmerica. I actually had a radio show there before coming on over to BlogTalkRadio. It’s time. This is Julie’s last time on BlogTalkRadio, Heart & Soul for Women of Faith, although of course Julie and I will be continuing our friendship forever and ever and I’m sure doing more talking together but just not using this particular venue.
Yes, June is the last month of Heart & Soul for Women of Faith; however, the good news is that all of these recordings will stay here until the end of time is my understanding. So what you need to do is go back and listen to the archives and maybe you’ll have a favorite and listen to that again. Julie, for my ezine, I’m actually going to have a Heart & Soul Gold section. So that when I send out my ezine once a month, I’ll just be recycling. They say we are supposed to repurpose things anyway, so I’m going to be recycling through the old shows. But yes, so that’s what I’m doing. That’s one of the changes. Is it a huge change? No, I’ll still be communicating with people in a big way and encouraging you all to come to my website, JoryFisher.com, and see what’s going on over there. I just won’t be using this particular platform. Besides, the picture of me that’s rotating on the show is kind of old anyway.
Julie Fleming: Well, that explains it.
Jory Fisher: There you go. I’ll just stop the show instead of going out and getting a new picture. But yes, the one that has Heart & Soul for Women of Faith on it, gosh, I guess we took that back in, I don’t know, 2009, 2008, something like that. My hairstyle has changed.
Julie Fleming: They do that. But of course, seriously, it’s not about the picture. So why are you choosing to end the show now?
Jory Fisher: Well, we have to be good stewards of our time and our energy, our resources, our money, all of that. I am doing more work here locally in the Baltimore area. I introduced myself as being a Top Six Expert, by Top Six, we are referring to people who are thriving. There are only 6% of entrepreneurs who are thriving in the United States and probably abroad, and so I help people, entrepreneurs, solopreneurs, I like to say purpose-guided service-based solopreneurs reach that 6%, so they can be truly thriving. While I do have a virtual practice so to speak as a Professional Certified Coach and Top Six Expert, I also am growing my influence, if you will, nurturing my flock here in the Baltimore area and it’s taking more and more of my time. So that’s a big part of it, Julie Fleming.
Julie Fleming: That is big and I know that’s exciting for you because you enjoy the in-person thing so much. Not that you don’t enjoy the long distance but when I think of you, I always see you with people, not with voices on the telephone.
Jory Fisher: Yes, it’s true. So much of my work as an entrepreneur has been on the phone, at the computer, and it’s just good for me to get out of the house and out and about. I say to people, “Don’t be a cave-preneur.” I just strongly believe that God led me to create this show way back in 2008, 2009. Now I strongly believe God is moving me to do other things.
Julie Fleming: Absolutely. So looking back over the course of your life, how do you feel about change?
Jory Fisher: I’m okay with it. I’m totally cool with it. My family was Navy. My father was an officer, then my brother became an officer, and as you know, Julie, my daughter is an officer. If you are going to be in the Navy, if you’re going to be in the military, then you have to accept the fact that change is a constant. So we moved around a lot. I was in a lot of different schools and as soon as I got older I was noticing, couldn’t help but notice, that I did not just go to one job and stay there forever. I kind of thought I would. I remember when I started after my master’s degree in Spanish as a bilingual secretary at the World Bank in Washington DC, I thought, “Well, this is just where I’m going to be for years and years and years.” No, I think I lasted nine months and I was bored to death and so I went to the Federal Government. Then after four years or so of that, I went to law school, and if you look at my resume, you’ll see that I’ve lived a lot of lives.
Julie Fleming: I think it sets you apart that you are totally cool with change. Most people, me included, can’t say that.
Jory Fisher: That could be because I’m an extrovert. It probably has a lot to do with the fact that I grew up in the Navy, but of course I know people who grew up that way and it made them even more introverted because they hated it. Of course the Navy wouldn’t move our family in the summer. Oh no. We moved in December. We moved in March. My poor brother, he had to move… We moved from Naples, Italy in March of 1965. My brother was a senior in high school and he went to his new high school, Marshall High School in Falls Church, Virginia, for two months because we couldn’t leave him behind in Naples. Anyway, that made me flexible. I think being an extrovert has helped, I think definitely I would say yes.
Julie Fleming: I can imagine that, and I wonder kind of, chicken and an egg, right? Did the change make the extrovert or did the extrovert make the change easy?
Jory Fisher: I know. For all we know, I’m an extrovert and introvert. I don’t know.
Julie Fleming: That would be fun. So you alluded to this question earlier. What do you think the purpose of change is, or do you think there is a purpose to change?
Jory Fisher: I do, I absolutely do. I think that change challenges us and I think challenge is good. While we are here talking military things, somebody I admire a great deal even though he wasn’t in the Navy is Gen. George S. Patton and he said, “Accept the challenges, so that you may feel the exhilaration of victory.” Change is a challenge and if we accept it, we embrace it, and then we actually move into it and accomplish it, oh wow. That exhilaration of victory is pretty darn awesome. I think change helps us grow. I think it helps keep us fresh. It certainly stretches us.
Julie Fleming: Definitely, yes. I think that’s a place where the flexibility really makes a difference because it can stretch us in the good kind of yoga stretching way or for me, it can stretch just kind of like being on a rack if we are resisting change.
Jory Fisher: That’s funny you would say that, I just started Hatha yoga. I took a class last Tuesday, so that means I need to go again. It’s been a week, yes, almost a week. There is a lot of stretching involved but that’s good. I’m used to Pilates. I’m just not that used to yoga and holding a position a long time until it just sort of loosens up.
Julie Fleming: Well, there is an analogy with life there.
Jory Fisher: Absolutely.
Julie Fleming: How does your faith play into the changes that you have made in your life, that you are making now, all of the changes?
Jory Fisher: I think change keeps us humble and that’s a good thing. It keeps us leaning on God and that’s a great thing. One of my favorite verses is “I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me,” Philippians 4:13. If we are just constantly leaning on ourselves, we can either get blown away because we do a lousy job or if we do a good job then we can get a little too puffed up. So I think it’s good to be humble and it’s good to lean on God and gain our strength through God. In fact a verse I was reading this morning when I was doing my devotions, 2 Chronicles 16:9, “For the eyes of the Lord range throughout the earth to strengthen those whose hearts are fully committed to Him.” I want my heart to be fully committed to God and I want to be strengthened by the Lord. It’s just neat to get your strength from God and not have it be just something you’ve tried to muster up yourself. It’s so silly to really do that when you can have God do it for you or with you, you know.
Julie Fleming: Mm-hmm, absolutely. In an odd way, kind of, there is an analogy with what we were talking about earlier with the clients. Do you take on change to get closer to God or do you hold on to God because change is coming and you can’t stop it? Where is your focus?
Jory Fisher: You are right. It is very similar to that. Where is your attitude? Where is your focus? But the thing is with God, that’s a relationship. And let’s just take our relationship, Julie. We grow in our relationship with each other because it gives us joy, it gives us strength, it gives us peace. It gives us harmony and it helps us go out and serve others better. Getting together with you, which we will of course continue to do, both on the phone and in person even though we won’t be doing this particular radio show again, it helps us just do life together and it gives us power, it gives us strength to go out and serve others better. That’s how it is with God.
Julie Fleming: Absolutely. Encouragement, comfort, I mean so many things come from relationship. With people and with God. So you have alluded to this somewhat but I know there is more to the story. What lies ahead for you?
Jory Fisher: Well, yes that’s right. I did mention the Top Six Mastermind Group, which is really, really exciting and that’s a live, in-person select group for service-based solopreneurs who are serious about growing their businesses and making a bigger, more meaningful difference in the world. I love saying that. You guys have probably heard me say that kind of thing each week in my introduction here. But a really cool thing and—you happen to know this lovely young lady, Julie—is my daughter, Jana Beeson, is moving here this month, and we are going to create videos together, at least that’s the plan.
We both graduated from SMU, Southern Methodist University. We both have strong theater backgrounds. She was a theatre major at SMU. I started as a theater major and switched to Spanish, but I still have that in me and we are both avid entrepreneurs. In fact, Jana is now one of my assistants in my coaching and mentoring business, and she’s my partner in EMSquared, which is the social enterprise I talk about, also known as the Hope Bar Project. It’s helping feed malnourished children around the world. So videos with Jana, that’s one thing and another thing is I’m always going to love recording conversations from time to time and posting them on my blog. So I’ll be doing that and so be sure everyone to come on over to JoryFisher.com and enter your name and email address, so you can continue to enjoy listening to conversations of amazing people like Julie Fleming.
So that is it, I mean, really just growing stronger with the EMSquared Hope Bar project enterprise with Jana and going stronger with the Top Six Experts. Just doing more in-person and a little bit less virtual. I will always have virtual clients but I’m really enjoying the in-person and getting out and doing more in-person networking as well. So that’s what’s on the horizon, Ms. Julie.
Julie Fleming: That’s so exciting and you have such a body of work with six and a half, almost seven years of radio shows. So it’s wonderful, because on the one hand, you are off to new exciting things and yet you are leaving so much that people can continue to explore. I would love to put just a little bug in your ear. I hope that some of your future conversations will involve the next chapter in the lives of some of your previous guests.
Jory Fisher: Oh, gee. What could you be talking about?
Julie Fleming: Wasn’t even thinking of me actually!
Jory Fisher: You should have.
Julie Fleming: I would love to be included, but you have so many amazing guests and every now and again, I will find myself thinking, I wonder. I’m listening to a show. I love to listen to your shows actually when I’m traveling, when I’m in the car. So periodically, I will be listening to a show from a couple of years ago and think, “I wonder what’s happening now.” So there is much that you have already done for people to discover and I hope you will pick up, now and again. I know it’s going to be in a different format at different periods, but every now and again I hope you pick back up with some of your earlier guests.
Jory Fisher: That’s a great idea. I know so many amazing people and that’s really, really true. I want to say to my listeners, if you are thinking about doing a show, definitely do it with BlogTalkRadio, they are just so great and as I said I can think of so many of them as my friends. How many times have I had to reach out to them and say, “Hey, help! My show is doing wonky things, I need your help,” and they are right there with me, which is terrific. Julie, I know you are familiar with that, but they are great. I also want to say that if you intend on having a weekly show, it’s X amount of work. If you’re intending on having a daily show, it’s X times five. So you just really need to decide how much time and effort do you want to be putting into it. I have a lot of people asking me this. “Gee, what is it like to be a radio show host?” Except for the occasional, technological challenge, it just became really easy.
I remember when I first started, I was nervous and now I just think, “Oh, I hope the technology works out.” So it’s a good, good thing to do. It’s wonderful to get your voice out there and especially if you are interviewing other people to give them an opportunity to have a platform. I highly recommend, highly recommend BlogTalkRadio and then when it’s time to move on, move on. I think about people who, maybe they are a consultant and they are hired to come in and do some changes in a particular business or corporation or something. Then instead of moving on, they stay and they kind of outlive their welcome and they don’t do so well, and they are not living in their genius zone anymore. I guess I kind of want to leave while I’m still on a roll here.
Julie Fleming: Yes, I can see that. I’m curious. I have never asked you this. I’m going to put you on the spot a little bit. What are the top three things that you have learned over the last six and a half, seven years of hosting Heart & Soul for Women of Faith?
Jory Fisher: One is that there are just great people out there doing great things, and so I have loved hearing their stories and I have learned in general that so many people have gotten into their hearts and souls. So many people are doing wonderful things, so not a brand new learning but a confirmation of what I suspected was true.
Julie Fleming: Right, deepening.
Jory Fisher: Deepening, good word. Can we call that number one?
Julie Fleming: We certainly can.
Jory Fisher: Number two is that there are a lot of people who need to hear these messages. I have had so many people email me or text me or give me a message on Facebook, even friends from high school that I haven’t seen since, okay, I graduated in 1971, you know, just saying, “Oh Jory, thank you very much. I’ve just been really blessed by your radio show.” I’m thinking, whoa, I didn’t even know you were listening to my radio show.” So any Langley Saxons out there, I want to do a shout out for you, from McLean, Virginia. All right.
Julie Fleming: I heard the cheerleader there, Jory, just for a second.
Jory Fisher: There she was. There she was. So that was definitely something else that I’ve learned, that a lot of people are grateful for encouragement, are grateful for encouragement. I guess the third thing is how important it is to listen as an interviewer and that’s very important as a coach too. I have been on shows as a guest and it’s downright irritating when the host takes over. It’s kind of like you, the guest, are just an excuse for the host to be able to talk about themselves in their programs and it’s like, “Wait, you invited me on this show. Why?” I mean, it hasn’t happened often but enough times for me to realize that as a host or in this case as a co-host, it’s really nice to listen, ask good questions, and just allow the story to unfold without trying to force yourself into it.
Julie Fleming: That sounds like a beautiful life lesson, way more than a radio show.
Jory Fisher: Mmm. I’ve loved it. I really have. I’m sad that we’re drawing this to a close but I just know that God is saying, “Okay, come on. Get out of your comfort zone.” Isn’t that funny? Some people probably listening to this are going, “Wait a minute. A radio show is your comfort zone?”
Julie Fleming: It is now.
Jory Fisher: It is now. I remember when I first thought about the idea of doing a radio show. It made me nervous but I’m really comfortable, you guys, maybe a little too comfortable. I mean, you got to see me. I’m in shorts and a t-shirt and we all know that my dogs are always at my feet when I’m broadcasting. This is probably just way too comfortable. I need to get out of my comfort zone and challenge myself to do bigger things which also includes in addition to network and running the Mastermind Group—oh I’m so glad you asked, Julie—is more speaking, in-person speaking.
Julie Fleming: Oh wonderful. You’re a fabulous speaker. That’s exciting.
Jory Fisher: You’re a sweetheart but this means getting dressed up, which I like to do. I like putting on makeup, doing my hair, blah, blah, blah. So I need to do more of that too. Yes, that’s why.
Julie Fleming: Beautiful.
Jory Fisher: But I think the change is important, that people who are passionate about living, passionate about working, we love change and we should. I just think happy people embrace change and that’s something that Karen Hirsch and I talked about. We’ve been going through her husband’s book, Living A Significant Life, and he refers to himself as a “challenge-aholic” and encourages himself and others as well to have challenges, to embrace change. It’s just really important. It’s all about positive attitude and doing something that is outside your comfort zone.
Julie Fleming: Mm-hmm, that’s the only way we grow.
Jory Fisher: So that’s it, ladies and gentlemen. Julie, what last words might you have here for our audience?
Julie Fleming: I would just encourage our audience to listen in their own lives and with the people with whom they are speaking, and see what kind of changes they may be being called to.
Jory Fisher: Hmm, that’s good.
Julie Fleming: It’s all around, always.
Jory Fisher: And again how can people reach you, Julie?
Julie Fleming: For the last time on this show, I will say Julie@LexinnovaConsulting.com. That is L-E-X-I-N-N-O-V-AConsulting.com.
Jory Fisher: I had to do that. I’m sorry.
Julie Fleming: I know you did.
Jory Fisher: Will that be forwarded to…
Julie Fleming: It will be forwarded. Yes. That’s another good tip, never ever let go of your old email addresses because you never know when someone is going to reach out to you.
Jory Fisher: How true is that?
Julie Fleming: So true.
Jory Fisher: Right. Well, how about this. Would you please pray for our listeners and then I’m torn between doing the doxology and doing Green Onions just for old time’s sake?
Julie Fleming: Choices, choices. Well, I will pray and we’ll see where we go. How’s that?
Jory Fisher: Okay, sounds good. Thank you.
Julie Fleming: Heavenly Father, thank you for the joy of this time together. Thank you for the lessons that we all hear through Jory, through her guests, through conversations, through the thoughts that they spark. And thank you for giving us the opportunity to step into change and to trust in you, knowing that even when change is scary, you are the constant and you will hold us through whatever we may be facing, whatever we may be stepping into. We praise you. We pray that we will always be of service to you through what we’re doing, and we thank you for all of the gifts that you’ve given us. In Christ’s name, we pray, amen.
Jory Fisher: Amen. That is just so beautiful. Well everybody, thank you for listening to Heart & Soul for Women of Faith. If you want to, I’m just going to play a few seconds of this. Maybe this will remind some of my listeners from long ago of a certain stage in their life. I just love this. When I hear it on the radio, I’m like, “Okay.” Memories. Are you dancing?
Julie Fleming: I am dancing, I am popping my fingers. I’m doing the whole nine yards.
Jory Fisher: I love it. All right everybody. You’ve been great. We still have three more weeks, you know. This was the last show with Julie, but then we have Jennifer, Karen, and Kim, so three more weeks of Heart & Soul for Women of Faith. Thank you so much everybody. Now, we’re going to be play a little bit more gentle music. Wow, what a contrast.
Julie Fleming: Beautiful.
Jory Fisher: All right everyone. This is Jory Fisher encouraging you to create optimal health for your life, ministry, and business so you can fulfill your purpose with joy and grace, and glorify God through success. Thank you, Julie. You’re wonderful.
Julie Fleming: Thank you, Jory. It has been a blast. Bye everyone.
Jory Fisher: All right, bye. Until we meet again. May the Lord bless you and keep you and be gracious onto you. May the Lord grant you prosperity and peace. Listen to this beautiful music by David Nevue at DavidNevue.com. Bye everybody.
Transcription by Alma Noefe